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Tenses
Jul 25, 2008 12:44:10 GMT
Post by Dave M on Jul 25, 2008 12:44:10 GMT
> If he had a licence, he was insured to drive my car <
Hi, David
Yes, the sentence does look odd at first sight, but it's a format that does have a use, when a situation is quite possible, and something can be deduced from it.
For that example, consider this background story: A businessman goes on a six-month cruise, leaving his car with his driver. While he's away, an office messenger borrows the car and crashes it. The car is insured for any employee of the company, subject to their having a licence. After some time, the driver finds out and is worried whether the lad was insured, so rings his boss to ask. His boss replies "If he had a licence, he was insured to drive my car".
Here, the situation is potentially a real one: either the lad had a licence or he didn't (we're not talking about the situation which would have occurred if-he-had-one-even-though-we-know-he-hasn't).
If he DID (at the time of the crash), then he WAS insured (at the time of the crash): If he had a licence, he was insured to drive my car .
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Tenses
Jul 26, 2008 11:56:32 GMT
Post by Pete on Jul 26, 2008 11:56:32 GMT
As to "Well, if most people use it, how can it not be acceptable?", that's a point that Paul and I have disagreed upon many a time. I take the opposite view: "Just because the ignorant masses don't understand their own language, why does that make their linguistic errors correct?" Reductio ad absurdum: Eat excrement, 50 billion flies can't be wrong.
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Tenses
Jul 26, 2008 12:02:07 GMT
Post by Paul Doherty on Jul 26, 2008 12:02:07 GMT
Yep, Pete, that makes sense. If you're a fly.
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Tenses
Jul 26, 2008 16:14:52 GMT
Post by Pete on Jul 26, 2008 16:14:52 GMT
But do you agree that it is apposite to the question of whether common usage must perforce be correct?
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Tenses
Jul 26, 2008 17:02:26 GMT
Post by Paul Doherty on Jul 26, 2008 17:02:26 GMT
Yes, I think it proves the point! If you're a fly, it's a good guide.
I'm not, after all, arguing that how people speak or write should be a guide for cattle. But for people, what else is there? If everyone bar you decides that enormity means great size, then that's what it means.
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Tenses
Jul 26, 2008 17:28:13 GMT
Post by Twoddle on Jul 26, 2008 17:28:13 GMT
Yes, I think it proves the point! If you're a fly, it's a good guide. I'm not, after all, arguing that how people speak or write should be a guide for cattle. But for people, what else is there? If everyone bar you decides that enormity means great size, then that's what it means. Flies? Cattle? Most of the allegedly human, carbon-based life forms (thanks Geoff) I've encountered in my life act in much the same way. They should be guided, not followed.
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Tenses
Jul 26, 2008 17:39:05 GMT
Post by Dave M on Jul 26, 2008 17:39:05 GMT
Or swotted.
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Tenses
Jul 26, 2008 18:18:48 GMT
Post by Pete on Jul 26, 2008 18:18:48 GMT
Flies? Cattle? Most of the allegedly human, carbon-based life forms (thanks Geoff) I've encountered in my life act in much the same way. They should be guided, not followed. Rules are for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men.
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Tenses
Jul 26, 2008 18:27:31 GMT
Post by Pete on Jul 26, 2008 18:27:31 GMT
I looked this up just now and all the internet sources I can find tell me that it is a quote by Douglas Bader. I always thought it was older, perhaps Wilde or Shaw. But my Oxford Dictionary of Quotations doesn't seem to have it at all.
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Tenses
Jul 26, 2008 20:54:58 GMT
Post by Tone on Jul 26, 2008 20:54:58 GMT
>Or swotted.<
Has Dave M gone American spelling? (Or is he studying for it?)
Tone
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Tenses
Jul 26, 2008 21:50:25 GMT
Post by Twoddle on Jul 26, 2008 21:50:25 GMT
I looked this up just now and all the internet sources I can find tell me that it is a quote by Douglas Bader. I always thought it was older, perhaps Wilde or Shaw. But my Oxford Dictionary of Quotations doesn't seem to have it at all. If Bader did say it, I wonder whether it was before or after disobeying the rule prohibiting slow rolls below 1,000 feet. (He did one at 30 feet and lost both legs in the crash.) There was a documentary about him on TV the other night - long-winded but interesting.
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Tenses
Jul 26, 2008 23:16:39 GMT
Post by Pete on Jul 26, 2008 23:16:39 GMT
I looked this up just now and all the internet sources I can find tell me that it is a quote by Douglas Bader. I always thought it was older, perhaps Wilde or Shaw. But my Oxford Dictionary of Quotations doesn't seem to have it at all. If Bader did say it, I wonder whether it was before or after disobeying the rule prohibiting slow rolls below 1,000 feet. (He did one at 30 feet and lost both legs in the crash.) There was a documentary about him on TV the other night - long-winded but interesting. Whichever it was, I think we can agree that he was a fool, albeit a brave one.
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Tenses
Jul 27, 2008 0:00:11 GMT
Post by Paul Doherty on Jul 27, 2008 0:00:11 GMT
One of my customers lives in the rooms occupied Douglas Bader while he was posted to RAF Kenley. They are part of a country house requisitioned by the War Department, and include a rather splendid verandah with views over the lawns.
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Tenses
Jul 27, 2008 8:23:36 GMT
Post by Bertie on Jul 27, 2008 8:23:36 GMT
You have customers? You are in trade?
<faints>
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Tenses
Jul 27, 2008 12:42:13 GMT
Post by Paul Doherty on Jul 27, 2008 12:42:13 GMT
Sorry about that.
When I remember, I call them clients. Does that help?
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